[scrawnybob]

hi

yep first off loosing with KK or AA is always going to feel bad but ...

even with KK or AA you can and will loose sometimes - and most importantly if you havent moved all-in preflop (where you were an 80% favourite) you must must must re-assess your hand when you see the flop

defining a badbeat is about when you or the other player went all-in NOT what your original hands were

preflop was a 3 way raised pot but with all of you having big stacks the player with the 23 off was taking a cheap punt with massive implied odds -

ie. he knows you have a big hand and also knows he can afford to see the flop with a weak (very easy to fold hand if nothing hits, but also a hand that could really mess up a big hand if he hits)

I'm not saying his preflop play was great - but you must not assume players will not play bad hands calling a moderate raise preflop - they can and they will

this is part of poker - and being a tricky player does involve not playing ABC all the time

on the flop you were totally dominated (its tough but its the reality)

now at this point you have to think about possibilities and why a player would move all in on that flop

33 - A3 suited, ace 4 diamonds (on a draw), AA or 55

ok so 23 off is pretty random but you should have been thinking about the range of hands above - and this should have been enough for you to think twice

by the time it comes to you ... you've had the medium stack move all-in and the chip leader go all-in behind ...

so you now have two stong shows of aggression on an odd looking flop ... alarm bells should be ringing (this is a tournament your aim is to accumulate as many chips as possible as safely as possible - not get into big confrontations on difficult flops)

You must think to yourself ...

the big stack raised all-in for 1 of 2 reasons -

he wants to isolate the smaller stack and take him out or not without risk of having you call (and making his commitment bigger and a 3 way pot) ... therefore he has a big pair (but not aces or 3- or 55)

or the big stack re-raised allin because he wants to look like the above and he has a massive hand and he wants your chips too and has figured your going to call as you have enough of a hand to make that mistake ... therefore he has AA. 55, 33 or 3A

I guess in summary (it wasnt a bad beat - when they put your hand to the test you were very much behind) but most importantly you need to say to yourself is this the time to go out on a limb just because my hand preflop looked great but maybe now I'm behind ... and if I am its now going to cost me all my chips

If I'm facing a decision for all my chips ... I want to know that everyone has done what I hoped / expected ... not done everything to make me feel uneasy about the hand

I would have folded in this situation - the risk (of giving chips to the chip leader) far out weight the reward (its not you making the moves)

I dont generally like to be seeing the flop with AA KK QQ with more than one other player and I want to have control of the game

in this situation - you should have been worrying / thinking preflop about this situation and how it could play out ... I wouldnt like having the chip leader in a 3 way hand ... there is too much opportunity for them to put you to the test and uncomfortable

hope thats a help (not a very focussed post by me but hope there are some useful ideas and thoughts for you to work with and develop)

cheers scrawnybob